[The-Jack-DeCk]

Since somehow, people had a lack of sense within themselves and down-voted this suggestion, then I can only hope that Jen's compromise pulls through

I don't see how that sort of attitude is going to help build support for your position.

Good sir, you have bested me. You are correct, such an attitude is futile for gaining support for my stance on this issue. I apologize to all who I may have offended with said statement. I agree that I should have dealt with this situation in a more civil manner and that my behavior was inappropriate. I agree that instilling my opinion that people who do not support my suggestion have a lack of sense is ridiculous, offensive, and childish. I am truly sorry, and I hope anybody who sees this message can forgive me. I do not want to make enemies and I believe this thread in general, and my argumentative position, has forced many to turn against me. It is within my best nature to apologize to all of you, as you can most likely tell by my numerous attempts to do so within this single paragraph.

What I can not apologize for, however, is the fundamental concept behind my rigorous attitude. Sure, I said many things that I regret, and now I am coming back to my senses and apologizing. Many people have probably said things recently that they either do regret, or should feel sorry for. These instances, I noticed, happened more frequently in-game then on this thread. But nonetheless, they made no such apology. I have turned people against me because I wish to FIGHT for the rights of those who wish NOT TO. I am perfectly acceptable of my self-instilled position to battle against this feature. I fear that many arguments will come out of it. I understand it is completely hypocritical to argue ferociously in order to stop arguments. But what I find more disgusting than my hypocrisy is that people are willing to pin myself as the bad guy for this entire instance! I find that people who support this feature are using the counter-arguments of "Why remove it?" "It won't hurt you!" "You won't die unless you head straight to spawn!" Well my friends, I disagree with your position so much that I was willing to lose my temper and distract from my calm demeanor that I have been trying to keep ever since my best friends on MineRealm, texas_hitman, hshizzlefresh, and most of Trinity, were forced off of this server, regardless of whether that forcing was directly their fault and their own doing (in which case it is not physical forcing, but still forcing in some aspect nonetheless).

Ever since Trinity was disband, it has become increasingly hard for me to play on this server. This in no way is my fault or the fault of any staff members, especially our leader Intelli, who I have attacked directly on this thread and one other for supporting the Mist. It is the fault of the general nature of our community. Players like Prodigy9 are scarce, and that is why it felt like a dagger stuck in my heart to read his reply to my ludicrous comment. Even players with a higher social status on this game than Prodigy9 (no offense to my dear friend) are willing to be plagued with this disease that has stricken many. Is this disease a problem that has led to the downfall of this server we all love? No. There is no such downfall. Is this disease the general causation of MineRealm becoming filled with less loving and kind members? Perhaps not. Perhaps it is within my head and the newer generation of players has caused this server to be more tightly knit than ever. Perhaps it is not within my head! Perhaps players who come in, purchase a disbanding realm or receive items from those who quit, are instantly placing themselves into the community as a well-respected member and are having an influence on a community so new but so aged! It is with displeasure that I announce that many new players are being taken over with greed, not in the sense that they wish for credits more desperately than the rest of us, but with the sense that they are somehow tearing down the threads of the 3.0 era.

I must be insane. This is probably a feeling felt by none of the older players. Maybe they are more susceptible to change. Maybe this rant is so off-topic and irrelevant that when people muster the strength in themselves to stop doing something important and read this entire thing, that they will respond with more hate.

I should speak of the issue at hand now.

I should speak of why I am willing to type so much nonsense, and then hope that it will not be perceived as such.

Well if I shall do so, then I shall do so directly! This is my final plea on the matter. I fear that it will get shot down faster than my attempts to feel accepted on a server that I once was respected! But nonetheless, I must explain my position in depth.

Do I care about the Mist's direct effect on myself? No. I do not care if you think I am a selfish player, because in truth, I am. This is because of losing Trinity, and even though Arcane was glad enough to accept me, I am not where I belong. I do not care about the Mist's direct on myself, and it has nothing to do with the fact that some peg me as selfish. It has everything to do with the fact that it will never end up causing the death of mine unless I choose it to.

What I do care about, is that there are players on this server, who I myself have seen on other servers. PvP servers. And yet, they manage to feel so strongly about the PvP aspect of this community. Do they not understand the constant arguing and struggles that are inherit with this fighting online? Do they not understand the pain that they have caused others? Do they think that PvP is really better here, despite the fact that there are millions of servers that cater to PvP? These questions are rhetorical of course. The answer is yes to all of them. And the answer is the exact opposite of what it should be. And it befuddles me, as a rather intelligent but extremely sensitive and naive individual, as to why the answers are yes.

I would speculate as to why the answer is yes, but I need not do so. I such wish to tell you guys that the answer should be no. And I am not willing to type an entire rant within a rant as to why it makes little sense to actually care about PvP on this server. That being said, it is perfectly acceptable, in my eyes, to have an occasional joust with other members that you love and respect...

But as soon as you start killing those you don't know or don't respect, you are damaging this server more than a DoS attack! You are damaging this server with your lust to murder more than I damaged this server with my arguing with connorartman97 over a year ago, or my arguing with VVolfie a few days ago. Or anybody's arguing with anybody, ever. I can respect your choice to PvP with others. But I can not respect your choice to do so in a serious manner. In a manner where you can harm other people's feelings.

But, this is the internet. Feelings are supposed to get hurt. People are supposed to bully others over the internet to the point where they kill themselves, just so the bullies can get some sense of satisfaction in their lives. And that is certainly not the case with Minecraft, especially a well protected and enforced server such as MineRealm. But it is the case. Not to the severity of what I explained, but to some measurable amount.

The Mist is no exception. The Mist is taking those who wish not to fight, and although not technically forcing them to fight, forcing them to be apart of something just how I was forced away from Trinity, even after trying to keep it alive without the help of seasoned veteran players.

If you are fine with being part of the group of people who are forcing this upon the server, then I pass no judgement upon your character. But, it is your actions who define you. And even though I attempt to pass no judgement, others will, and honestly, I will probably do so to some extent as well.

But you may continue. You may continue to support this feature even if you are aware of what it is doing. You may continue to argue that it has no negative side effects, and you may be right.

You may also be wrong.

And if you are wrong, then I am by default correct. And I wish to be incorrect with all of my heart, soul, and mind. I wish that I was not the one who had to type this. I wish that I was not the wake-up call to some and the snooze button to others. I want you to have read this and woken up, and seen what I see when I write a destructive and inappropriate response on this thread. I do not want you to see this post and hit the metaphorical snooze button. For one, the snooze button is a weak metaphor in itself. But I do not want you to be able to sleep with the thoughts that you support this feature. And that is ridiculous to the highest degree. Maybe why I chose such as dumb metaphor.

I want you to change. I don't want to fight with anybody on this server. I want to be like the rest of you, who are fine with how things are going. I don't want to submit this post. But I feel like I must. I feel like it is my responsibility to stop the Mist. Regardless of whether or not it gets me banned or hated or cussed at.

I have already been disrespected enough, and I have already disrespected enough. So I thank all of you. I thank those who have fought to kill the innocent on this server. I thank those who have gotten into arguments with me, or those who have stolen my items. I thank you because I have pulled the final straw out of my arsenal to stop what I believe is a monstrosity. And you helped me do so.

So, essentially, maybe the Mist is not a bad thing. Even though I spent an hour just now writing about how it may be, I realize that perhaps it is not. This is because it is just a feature that may end up forcing one out of a hundred to fight. But that is not the point. This Mist is food for the worst nightmare somebody who loves this server like myself can have. The Mist is fuel to the fire that is burning us all to the ground. I don't ask you to change your mind or opinion about the Mist, but I ask you to change your demeanor. I don't want to argue with you all, or with any of you. I don't want to be angry because every single project I have ever started on this server has failed. I don't want to be mad because although you all know my name and know who I am, you don't know what I feel. And that is why I am posting this. I want you all to know how I truly feel about the reasons behind my hatred of the Mist.

Not the Mist itself.

But what arises behind the Mist.

A darker, more terrifying Mist. A concept that has suffocated many, and a terrible plague that I am only trying to heal. Even if it seems like I am making matters worse.

I thank you again Prodigy9. Without you, I would have never written this. Without you, I would have never felt like I must be a delegate on some threads and voice my opinion. But as powerful as a single opinion may be, I hope that this one post can be more powerful than that. I hope, with much doubt but much reason, that this post can change us all. And I know it won't. I know this post will cause more flame.

So hit the like button, the quote button, or just yell at me through this medium of the internet called the forums. But as long as I have swayed one person, not to be on my side, but to understand why I was upset, and why I feel lost, then I have done what I wished to do.

Intelli, I am sorry for posting this. I am sorry if you read this and think that it has anything to do with essentially anything offensive or flame-worthy. And I am sorry to you, for damaging a relationship that I have tried to start up. But I hope you know that the only reason I still play on this server is because I have hope. Because I have hope that I can learn from my time on MineRealm and be a better person in real life. And that should be what MineRealm does to people. We should establish real life feelings for people we meet on the internet. And when those feelings get broken, like mine are as of now, we should learn how to thank those who broke them, for they taught us how to repair them as well.

Thank you all for reading this. I hope next time you see me post in the forums or play on the server for an hour or so, you look back to this. For I don't wish this to become meaningful to us all, I just wish for it to become meaningful to me.

[ColdF3ar]

-rant snip-

Jack, I'm going to suggest to you and others whom feel similar what I've suggested like 5 times already in this thread:

Give the Mist a chance! TRY IT OUT!

Seriously, have you even tried to pvp with the mist? Try it out for once and see if its something that really might be fun. IMO, this is better than the PVP in the old days. People would only just camp in guilds at the nether portal literally all day. At least a large majority of people during the mist come with the intention of jumping around and being stupid like me. You don't even need to bring anything. I find the satisfaction in fisting someone to death.

Look what happened yesterday:


I literally was laughing my butt off when it happened. Plus it the server killed me instantly for committing this sin haha.

Yes, its true, Minerealm is evolving into a different type of player base. But you know what, who cares! I make the best of it. Imperial has gotten together and we have been building a community city area together. Everyone makes a build and we all contribute something. This was way before that community city thread was even a thing. You make Minerealm what it is. As much as the old days were fun, the new days of Minerealm fun are on you, make the most of them.

[cubeguy314]

Jack, I also worried about players being forced to fight against their will; however, after participating in Mist PvP, I only saw people fooling around with stone and iron swords and replaceable, cheap armor. There were very few people who actually took Mist PvP seriously. As for other players, you can still teleport home if you're caught in it. What happens if you're caught at home? It's your home! You can build up your own defenses, and if you're on your own private realm, you might even be able to trap the intruder!
As of right now, it doesn't seem like the Mist is a bad thing. PvP is easily avoidable during it, and little to no players are actually negatively affected by it. I've even seen players returning items after the Mist PvP was over!
Give it a try and experience and observe it firsthand.

[dlgn]

Cold, I played the Mist and enjoyed it, but what JackDeCker said still stands. Now, some of you may not recall this, but there was once a time when Spawn was full of players, almost all the time. We generally had at least 60 players on, and Spawn would contain at least 10 of them, and sometimes as many as 50 (during the glorious days when we would have 100+ people on at once). This declined, however, as the community became less tightly bound in the manner that Jack explained, and The Mist further contributes to this effect: there's no way that could possibly occur with the threat of The Mist hanging over us.

[SkullRose]

There isn't really anything keeping people away from spawn. The mist rarely happens and it really is for a short period of time. I was actually bummed yesterday when it ended lol I felt like it was too short.

The only thing I still reallyyyyyyyyyyy don't like is that trade has pvp enabled. I feel that trade should definitely be safe zone but that's mostly becasue I afk there and I read somewhere that Intelli wrote if you've been afk for 5 minutes you can't get beaten to death but it would suck if the second you go afk the mist happens and you're dead.

BUT other than that, it's like Cold and many others have said, give it a try! I did, and I HATED the concept of it at first. And most people do just fist fight to death over and over. and it's like the only chance you'll ever get to kill Intelli xD

I can honestly say I now look forward to the mist <3

[cubeguy314]

Now, some of you may not recall this, but there was once a time when Spawn was full of players, almost all the time. We generally had at least 60 players on, and Spawn would contain at least 10 of them, and sometimes as many as 50 (during the glorious days when we would have 100+ people on at once). This declined, however, as the community became less tightly bound in the manner that Jack explained, and The Mist further contributes to this effect

Actually, I've seen more people playing at spawn participating in the Mist than any other time I've been to spawn.

[The-Jack-DeCk]

I don't have the dedication to post another rant, but hopefully this has some merit nonetheless:

After my horrendously long post, you guys re-institute the same trivial arguments about the Mist as a response to a rant that purposefully strays 100% away from said trivial arguments. I suppose this is partially my fault for posting said rant, but seriously, if I wanted to rekindle the exact same argument then I would not have spent almost an hour talking about something a lot more crucial.

What JackDeCker said still stands.

Thank you dlgn for speaking beyond the simple manner of the Mist and addressing its effect on the nature of the community.

As I am the creator of the thread, I wish to tell you all that I support straying slightly off topic and talking more in depth about the Mist. It is clear that simple support or denial of the Mist is futile seeing as this thread is rejected. I sincerely apologize if that was not clear in my string of multiple paragraphs that attempted to go in to a lot more depth.

Edit: No offense Cold, but after you fully admitted that you have influence on changing MineRealm it seemed really odd to me that you failed to address the problems in doing so.

[Meowrocket]

I just think it would be... on-topic? for me to say this, but I find that the Mist is bringing at least ME closer to other players, if not them to me. Sure, I may kill someone I don't know, but when I show them kindness and give them their things back, they show me kindness in return, and I feel like I start to know them a little. I find it a chance to meet people I wouldn't have if I just stayed at my realms and talked to my buddies all day. Sure, working on your land is fun, but sometimes it's nice to get out there, out of your comfort zone and meet some people. I killed someone the other day, and afterwards we ended up adding each other as buddies, and they're cooler than I expected. Outside the PVP, I see it as pulling together those daring to step outside where they feel safe, and expose themselves a little to the public.

Just my opinion. :]

-Meow

[Valendr0s]

Since somehow, people had a lack of sense within themselves and down-voted this suggestion, then I can only hope that Jen's compromise pulls through

I don't see how that sort of attitude is going to help build support for your position.

Good sir, you have bested me. (etc etc)

I wonder what the Declaration of Independence or Paine's "Age of Reason" would have looked like if they'd used bold, italics, and larger fonts for emphasis on certain points... Just a silly digression. Carry on with the debate.

Personally I've yet to be killed by anyone during the Mist, and yet I find the idea behind it distasteful. Having to watch your back on your own plot seems sort of antithetical to the concept behind minerealm when I first joined (many moons ago). Had I wanted a PvP server, I would have joined a PvP server.

Why have protected realms/plots at all if the argument is to add a level of danger or chaos to the world? If minecraft is 'supposed' to be a certain way, then surely this is an appeal to nature. We have /realms to protect the users' works from griefing. To give a level of safety and comfort to every member that isn't available in the natural vanilla server. Disabling pvp is the same.

Was the pvp in borderlands and nether not the compromise for the pvp-less overworld? I still recall feeling somewhat excited as I traversed the borderlands when they were first instituted in search for jungle tree saplings. I was acutely aware of my unsafe surroundings. I also remember being nervous sneaking into Nether in search of Blaze Rods...

But I could always feel my realm as home. I was grateful to the /realm system for allowing me to build in a way that, while mostly hidden from the world, could also have some elements of public, showoff, or even a touch of ostentation. I could invite the public into my realm without fear that they would destroy something or hurt me.

Indeed for a while I had a nether portal that was a popular exit, and I'd see people pop out and take a look around. I took a bit of pride in what I built, and was glad to show it to the passers-by (a treat rarely given to those living so far from spawn). I could label my mob grinders and allow people to use them as they wished.

But now I must question. I must fear the public in my own realm. I must shut my doors. I must lock myself away. I must hide my treasures and be sure to not keep my best gear on me. The mist does nothing but bring a hint of fear and mistrust between members of the community.

A creeper blowing up your house is PvE. We can all commiserate with one another's trials, and bring the community closer. We disable the creeper's damaging explosions precisely because it can be used FOR PvP or PvRealm; because people can use it to harass and frustrate other players. We ban players for harassment. We ban players for destroying the community aspect of this server... How is this forced pvp not the same?


Let me finish by asking this... How much do we lose by keeping this divisive system? How much do we gain? I propose we simply lose far more than we gain. There are other ways for members to PvP. All this does is remove the option NOT to PvP from those who don't want to participate.

Are there any other ways to advertise and encourage some PvP? Certainly. You could, for example, have a server-wide message saying 'a dark mist forms on -x- (/spawnpvp to particpate in this pvp session).'

The user is then teleported to an arena of sorts. There could be several arenas. There could be prizes and accolades for the 'winner'. So with so many other ways to have pvp in an otherwise pve world, why would we force this on people who don't want or don't like it? No argument for the mist I've yet seen couldn't be either exposed as fallacious (Minecraft is supposed to be dangerous), or resolved by a more structured opt-in system.

[Skylord_Fox]

I wonder what the Declaration of Independence or Paine's "Age of Reason" would have looked like if they'd used bold, italics, and larger fonts for emphasis on certain points... Just a silly digression. Carry on with the debate.

John Hancock
Using forum tactics since 1776.