[Intelli]

Alright. I think i follow how this block placement works and what counts, hes some scenarios, can i get a right/wrong check on the situations and the random questions answered please?
Warning, wall of text incoming



First set------------------------------------------------------------------------
If i create a realm, pick up one dirt, and place it back in the same spot i have +0 blocks placed. (removed one, added one, same spot)

Correct

If i create a realm, pick up one dirt, and place it back in a different spot, i have +0 blocks placed. (removed one, added one, different spot)

No, this would be +1 block placed.

For both of those, wouldnt it have to remember that i have -1 placed? or is it keeping the count and remembering which blocks went where separately or something?

It records where you dug up a block. However, digging up a block does not result in -1, it merely checks when you're placing a new block if it should add +1 to the blocks placed or not.

Under this rule set it would be impossible to add to your blocks placed by mining inside your realm, you have to mine outside the realm and bring new blocks in, because any block you pull out of the ground is a -1, and at best you can break even.

This would also mean that building underground bases would have a net negative effect because you hollow out more space than you fill in.

Incorrect. Digging up ground does not result in -1. Additionally, for placing blocks underground, it checks the block ID. So if you dug up a block of dirt, and placed a block of dirt in the same spot, it would not count it. However, if you dig up a block of dirt, and place a block of cobblestone in the same spot, then it WILL be counted.


Second set-------------------------------------------------------------------
Remove one dirt block, Create realm, place dirt block in same spot and i have +1 because dirt was removed before realm created. (or does it remember where every single block ever was, even outside realms?)

It would be +1 block.

Remove one dirt block, create realm, place dirt in different spot and i have a +1.

It would be +1 block.

If either of these are true then the best way to expand your realm would be strip mine your realm location before creating your realm. You would then be able to immediately place down many blocks and expand quickly.

Sure, but what would be the point of that?

Third set--------------------------------------------------------------------------
(concerning plant growth and server block placement/destruction)-
(assumed inside a realm)
(assuming plants are counted as blocks, if not then this section is moot)
Place one cacti for +1. Then....

(assume cacti growth and no extra height blocks added by player)
Cacti grows to full height. +2 for 2 blocks added to realm by server.(counter does not care how blocks came to be, just that they did)
Cacti grows to full height. +0 for server added blocks instead of player added.(counter cares how blocks got there)

Harvest the full grown cacti starting from top for -3.(counter does not care that blocks added by server, but does care that they are removed by player)
Harvest the full grown cacti starting from top for -1.(counter cares that blocks are placed by server, and ignores them)
Harvest the full grown cacti at bottom, causing it to auto break for -3.(counters does not care who breaks blocks)
Harvest the full grown cacti at bottom, causing it to auto break for -1.(counter cares that top 2 blocks were placed by server)

Basically, how the counter will treat crops that grow and add more blocks that are placed by the server but harvested by players. If counter dosen't care, then crops are net gain if unharvested, after harvest and replant they will be net neutral. If counter does care then crops are net negative to block count and all farms have to be outside the realm.

Reeds, cacti and trees will all be effected by this.

Plant growth does not count. Only blocks placed by a player.

Fourth and last set(finally!)------------------------------------------------------
(how the counter treats gravel and sand)
More questions than scenarios.
If a player places a block of sand and the sand falls, where does the counter think that block was placed? Where the player put it, or where it ended up? What if a player breaks into a gravel patch and gravel falls, does the counter change where the gravel was considered placed?

It only counts where the sand was originally placed. Placing another block of sand at the same location to fall won't count.

Most important question/scenario-
When a block of sand falls onto a pressure plate and is converted into an item by the server, is that a -1 for blocks placed? If not, its possible to place a sand block for +1 and then have it fall on a plate for -0 where you can pick it up. You could then re-place it for +1 where it falls and on and on in a loop like that for infinite points.
This would be bad

It only counts where the sand was originally placed. Placing another block of sand at the same location to fall won't count.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
tl;dr- Player vs Server placed/destroyed blocks and how does counter count?


Sorry if this was just a massive wall of text.

[Intelli]

Once again, all information posted in this thread is subject to change.

However, here's some basic information regarding realm expansion.

How realm expansion works:
Placing a # of blocks within your realm area will cause it to expand.

- Placing a single dirt block would increase the count. (+1)
- Digging up the dirt block you just placed would decrease the count. (-1)
- Digging up another dirt block that you didn’t place would have no effect. (0)
- Placing a dirt block you just dug up in the same location you dug it up from would not increase your count. (0)
- Placing a dirt block you just dug up in a different location than you dug it up from would increase the count. (+1)
- Digging up a dirt block, and replacing the hole with a different block (ex. cobblestone) would increase the count. (+1)

[kerovon]

Under this rule set it would be impossible to add to your blocks placed by mining inside your realm, you have to mine outside the realm and bring new blocks in, because any block you pull out of the ground is a -1, and at best you can break even.

This would also mean that building underground bases would have a net negative effect because you hollow out more space than you fill in.

Incorrect. Digging up ground does not result in -1. Additionally, for placing blocks underground, it checks the block ID. So if you dug up a block of dirt, and placed a block of dirt in the same spot, it would not count it. However, if you dig up a block of dirt, and place a block of cobblestone in the same spot, then it WILL be counted.

Does this mean that if you dig down through smoothstone, then use cobble that you gained from it to dig back up, that will count? I suspect that this will be cerevox's next question.

If either of these are true then the best way to expand your realm would be strip mine your realm location before creating your realm. You would then be able to immediately place down many blocks and expand quickly.

Sure, but what would be the point of that?

You have said that realms can expand limitlessly, as long as they don't get pinned in. if one group wants to claim as much territory as they can in a plum spot, like near spawn where there is a warp to it, they would probably go in and try to claim as much ground as they can. While the map is effectively infinite, convenient locations are limited. The way around this would be to enable some form of warping to the realms, which i haven't heard much about.

[Intelli]

Under this rule set it would be impossible to add to your blocks placed by mining inside your realm, you have to mine outside the realm and bring new blocks in, because any block you pull out of the ground is a -1, and at best you can break even.

This would also mean that building underground bases would have a net negative effect because you hollow out more space than you fill in.

Incorrect. Digging up ground does not result in -1. Additionally, for placing blocks underground, it checks the block ID. So if you dug up a block of dirt, and placed a block of dirt in the same spot, it would not count it. However, if you dig up a block of dirt, and place a block of cobblestone in the same spot, then it WILL be counted.

Does this mean that if you dig down through smoothstone, then use cobble that you gained from it to dig back up, that will count? I suspect that this will be cerevox's next question.

If either of these are true then the best way to expand your realm would be strip mine your realm location before creating your realm. You would then be able to immediately place down many blocks and expand quickly.

Sure, but what would be the point of that?

You have said that realms can expand limitlessly, as long as they don't get pinned in. if one group wants to claim as much territory as they can in a plum spot, like near spawn where there is a warp to it, they would probably go in and try to claim as much ground as they can. While the map is effectively infinite, convenient locations are limited. The way around this would be to enable some form of warping to the realms, which i haven't heard much about.

I'll have to add a check for smoothstone -> cobblestone, grass block -> dirt block, etc.
None of the block checking / expansion functionality has actually been created yet.

However, the /realm warp command is definitely already working =]

[Guest]

Hi there, I'm new to MineRealm and I've enjoyed the community here over the past couple weeks.

I'd like to tell you about my own experience on another similar server that has been quite successful in dealing with griefers, without limiting the builders access to tnt, buckets, etc.

Quite simply, we have a ranking system. Players that join the server are able to build, destroy, however they are unable to use the /home and /sethome commands. A pvp disabled spawn point was created with the border marked by lightstone pillars. As a player proves to be trustworthy (griefers are usually quite obvious imho) they gain access to this command. It also reflects true to the maturity and skill level of the player if they are able to travel far without /sethome, and successfully settle. This also promotes teamwork right of the get go.

What discourages the griefers (especially the ones with short attention spans) is that it is up to the player to decide how far away from the spawn point to settle. If this mean traveling 4-5 minedays, so be it. The amount of time that the newb (for lack of a better term) would take to locate and grief a "realm" would be long enough for a monitoring player (an advanced member with the tp to command for ex.) to investigate what the newb is up to. I've notice a very solid player base on this server, and I don't feel self policing would be a problem.

The only real downside to this is that you have quite a void area around the initial spawn point, with scattered, griefed wasteland, (hmm, I coin this "Wasteland") and the occasional structure where someone wasn't smart enough to travel far enough from spawn. What you do get, is a pretty cool outer ring of pristine settlements a few days from spawn.

That's about all I have to contribute. I'll be on and off until the new map is generated as I have a hard time committing my art to the impending armageddon of the current map.

Please feel free to take some/all/none into consideration, and I wish all the best to the Minerealm server community.

Glorystorm

[savesthedazed]

New map: I wouldn't be too terribly upset with switching to a new map now just to make it easier for everyone to capitalize on new resources. However, I would definitely feel bad for Kurachi. They have a lot of cool stuff that I'd hate to see go (especially the subway).

MineRealm: The realm concept is definitely interesting and I like the idea. I'm also glad cerevox asked all the questions (some of which I had in my head as well) and Intelli elaborated a bit more. If not a permanent addition, it would definitely be a nice experiment.

PVP: I'm not a big fan of PVP, but I'm not particularly against it either. My main concern was for loners (like myself) who live in the wilderness away from cities. We kind of get shafted if we're stuck in a PVP zone. However, it makes sense. Living on your own is generally more dangerous whereas banding together (in a city/realm/what-have-you) offers better protection (either by strength in numbers or disabling PVP within the realm). If I want more security, I'll just have to suck it up and join a realm.

Creepers and TNT: I really have little opinion on this one. I can cope either way.

Overall, I'm thinking that I like the direction that the server is heading in. The proposed changes don't appear to be too drastic and players should be able to adapt with ease.

[eagleclaw6]

Question 1:I often decide where to make my house based on the nature around it (top of a hill, by a lake, in the middle of a forest, etc.). If I started a realm around the center of my house, the basic realm would be 30x30. I then build my house with 90 blocks, and my realm increases in size. I'm assuming the realm increase 5 blocks in each direction from the center of the square. Is this correct?

Question 2: Let's say I make a house (with a realm) somewhere, place 90 blocks and increase the size, then abandon it and make another somewhere else. Would the realm stay at the increased size or will it reset back to 30x30?

Suggestion 1: I think that creepers should destroy blocks everywhere but around spawn. Disabling that is changing a key part of the game (mobs on a survival server) from the way Notch made it (and you try to make this a vanilla server). At the very minimum creepers should destroy blocks that aren't part of anyone's realm.

Suggestion 2: Would it be possible to have tnt/buckets/creepers/whatever the admins feel like banning at the moment enabled inside your own realm? I personally would enable all of them if I could.

Good luck with minerealm 2.0, I have faith that the admins will make it work with most people happy in the end!

[Intelli]

Question 1:I often decide where to make my house based on the nature around it (top of a hill, by a lake, in the middle of a forest, etc.). If I started a realm around the center of my house, the basic realm would be 30x30. I then build my house with 90 blocks, and my realm increases in size. I'm assuming the realm increase 5 blocks in each direction from the center of the square. Is this correct?

Correct


Question 2: Let's say I make a house (with a realm) somewhere, place 90 blocks and increase the size, then abandon it and make another somewhere else. Would the realm stay at the increased size or will it reset back to 30x30?

It would be back to 30x30, as it's a new realm.

Suggestion 1: I think that creepers should destroy blocks everywhere but around spawn. Disabling that is changing a key part of the game (mobs on a survival server) from the way Notch made it (and you try to make this a vanilla server). At the very minimum creepers should destroy blocks that aren't part of anyone's realm.

It'll be considered.

Suggestion 2: Would it be possible to have tnt/buckets/creepers/whatever the admins feel like banning at the moment enabled inside your own realm? I personally would enable all of them if I could.

It'll be considered.

Good luck with minerealm 2.0, I have faith that the admins will make it work with most people happy in the end!

[cerevox]

Its me again. And ker was correct, my next questions were going to be on type of blocks and how counter checked them.

Also, please be gentle on the stone->cobble check, i like the castle look so i tend to use a lot of cobble, even underground.

Alright, starting on my concerns this time.

Trees----------
You said plants don't count. Does this mean that plant items are totally ignored in the count? If so, what happens if I build a house out of logs? Does the counter simply ignore it or can it tell the difference between logs in a tree and logs in a house? And what about tree houses? What if i do the elf thing and make my realm out of giant trees with houses carved into them?

Sand----------
You said the sand block counts as being placed in the spot where the player puts it, not where it falls to.

So if I place a block of sand and it falls i have +1 from spot1. If i remove the sand from spot2 i do not get a -1 because there isn't any recorded sand there. I can then place a block of cobble on spot1 for another +1, so i am now gaining +2 from a spot with a single piece of cobble there. Would this work?

Or i could dig a shaft to bedrock with a plate at the bottom and place a single piece of sand in every single space all the way down the shaft, each piece of sand falls onto the plate, so would i now have +1 for each space and an empty shaft, or would the counter realize that the space is now clear?

-----------------------------------------------------
As for digging straight down, its faster than actually building things and would allow you to expand the realms borders quickly. If someone wanted to do that, it would seem easiest to fill in all their bedrock shafts with planks, as you can get a huge number of planks very quickly.

If realms can expand to infinite size then i could use the bedrock shaft filled with planks to expand to 1000x1000 size in a matter of hours. If i can get a few people to help me i could be there in an hour easily.

How you could fix this is actually have 2 counters. One is counting total blocks places and the other could count high level items and assign them points. The first few levels of expansion would be based on the total count alone.

However, the jump to size level 4 or 5 could require a certain number of points from higher level blocks. For example, you could get +10 points for an iron door and +20 for a block of gold placed. In order to reach level 4 you would need the total block count AND the total point count of 100 or something like that. This way people have to be placing more than just 10000 shafts filled with planks.

Also, when you discounted crops, what about signs, ladders, redstone wiring, doors, railways, minecarts and other such things. If they are not counted by the block counter than they can be counted to the higher level points count so that everything gives some sort of points.

----------------------------------------------------------------

As for fire and tnt would it be possible to have them disabled by default and allow realms to enable them if they choose to. This would prevent the whole world from being burned down or blasted, but if a realm wants to burn their own houses down or blow them up, they have that ability.

This would also allow realms to have their own unique points without threatening the rest of the server

Got mentioned while i was typing, so count this section as a vote for enable options.

----------------------------------------------------------------

Would it be possible for private realms to have a public section? If a realm goes private it can't really show itself off without allowing random tourists full access. If a realm could just declare a small stripe from the entrance to a central area to be public so visitors can come in a look around that would allow the realm to show off and also keep griefers from gaining full access just by asking to look around.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

How do the private realms actually keep people out? Is it just a check at the border or does it scan the whole realm? What about when a realm expands, if i am outside the borders and then inside after it expands, would i be teleported to the edge of the realm?

--------------------------------------------------------------------

There was something else i wanted to ask about but can't recall right now. Ill be back later with more textwall when i remember.


EDIT:
Also, if the realm increases in size by expanding 5 blocks in every direction, wouldn't it be impossible to expand if it encountered a realm on any side? Or does it then expand extra on the side away from the realm to compensate?

[panthers17nfl]

My questions are posted in a picture format simply because that's where the first question is as well >>